I saw this on Tito Vaselina. and I think it’s worth sharing:
My latest gut spilling on my political views (some of them at least) in response to comments on that blog I was telling you about:
These are all very effective examples of the straw man fallacy, where you exaggerate my view point, and then you debate against your own exaggeration. I never said that I think that government should do everything for people. You argue against communism, which I never proposed. I proposed a socialistic democracy, not pure socialism. I never proposed that the government take control. I’d like to see them maintain balance, because I don’t see how Joe and Jane Average American can stand up to the big corporations that really are in control of our lives on our own.
You’ve also provided excellent examples of the slippery slope fallacy, where you insist that some event must inevitably follow from another without any argument for the inevitability of the event in question. “If the government assists citizens to get healthcare, then the next thing you know, they’re going to be controlling where I can buy food” or “Obama says he’s only going to raise taxes to the rich, but then there will be nothing to stop him from raising everyone’s taxes and then they’ll take 60% of your paycheck.”
I said that the government could lend a hand, but maybe I should have been more explicit.
Here are my personal thoughts and experiences with healthcare in the U.S. – I think that it’s ridiculous that in this country that you say is the strongest in the world economically that so many of it’s citizens cannot get healthcare. Is the answer a state run system? I don’t know. I do know that I don’t think caring for peoples health should be a for profit business. That isn’t the best way to insure the best care. I don’t really see it as a system where I have choice. I am covered by my employer’s insurance, and that insurance company designates which doctor I can go and see and what they will cover. I have chronic Tonsillitis, but I cannot have them removed because the insurance won’t cover it, and I can’t afford to pay for the operation out of pocket. I also can’t afford an individual plan. How is that any different from what you describe as your concerns about state run system? I mean, I guess it’s a discussion about what’s worse – being at the hands of a bureaucrat or some rich stock holding asshole. Also, the Republicans aren’t staying out of your health business, either. Ron Paul proposed legislation in the House that would make birth control illegal. WTF is that? That’s small government? And he’s not alone. You know what, my grandmother was English, and she would never go to an American doctor. She would just wait until she was going back to England for a visit to have her check ups. A lot of my family still lives there. My aunt who grew up in the U.S. (still a voting, tax paying citizen of the U.S.) has been living in England for 15 years, and I asked her what her thoughts were on the healthcare and how it compares to private insurance in the states. Her answer was basically that our system was part of the reason why she was living there, and why she won’t be moving back to the states. Personally, my closest experience with something resembling state run healthcare was with the Navy, and I have to say that it was the best care I ever got. If this problem with my tonsils had started while I was still under their care, they would have taken care of it. Private insurance is failing me, and I’m not even that bad off. I think that there should be some kind of compromise. Tax breaks for insurance companies that insure low-income folks or sick people and tax penalties for insurance companies that cancel the policies of sick people or deny them access to procedures and medicines. Or state run insurance that individuals can opt out of, and get a tax credit if you do. I’m not some great economist, and I’m not a politician. I just know that I don’t think healthcare is a privilege.
Our government is whatever we vote for it to be. We’ve consistently been voting for more involvement from the government. So . . . if you don’t like that, try to convince your fellow citizens otherwise. I personally don’t think you’re very convincing. Especially when you say that our country is the strongest economically and yet the pound and the euro are kicking the dollar’s butt. And the reason why the colonies broke from England was for democracy and freedom from taxes, yes, but at that time, England was not a socialist country, and still isn’t. The way you worded that point made it seem like we were running from socialism.
And right now, we’re pumping trillions of dollars into occupying Iraq, while the Iraqi government has built up a surplus. I mean, if we’re going to spend money, why not spend it on ourselves?
As for William Ayers, et al, and as to why haven’t spoken to those . . . I don’t like to run my mouth on topics that I’m ignorant of. So, while I am still researching those assertions, I won’t respond. Sorry. I honestly wasn’t sure that Obama was going to get the Dem’s nomination. I sure didn’t vote for him in the primaries. But I just found this article about their connection – http://blog.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/2008/02/obamas_weatherman_connection.html Seems like the guy had a tenuous connection to Obama at best. Oh, and here’s another, from Fox News of all places, http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/04/17/fact-check-obamas-relationship-with-william-ayers/ That makes it seem like they knew each other a little better, but not like they were best chums. If anyone was going to make the most of a tawdry relation, it would be Fox, I would think. Oh and no where do I see any support that this man was a murderer, and the things I’ve now read say that no one was harmed in his groups bombings. I’m not abdicating bombing anything. That wouldn’t be the right way. But, I would like to know what your source is.
Here’s my thoughts on your ticket this week: McCain can’t answer a straight question with a straight answer (see today’s episode of The View); now you’re going to say that Obama can’t either, but I don’t think that’s a valid retort, because we’re not talking about him right now. This isn’t the first time I’ve seen McCain duck a question. There’s the reporter who asked him about his views and voting record on a birth control bill, and he told her he couldn’t answer her question without checking first. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q2y8dYwq01g I’m sorry, but I know what my opinions are. I don’t have to check with my employees and get back to you on any of that. And Palin is taking a note from his book, as you can see in her interview last night with Charles Gibson. Once again, she doesn’t sound that smart when she clearly doesn’t know what the man is asking about and she tries to answer it anyway. If that were me, I’d flat out say, I don’t know what the Bush Doctrine that you’re talking about is. Just like I’ll say, I don’t know anything about this William Ayers guy, except now I guess I do know a little.
What I know without a doubt is that on the issue I consider to be most important in this election, the occupation of Iraq, I am with Obama on that issue, as is the rest of my very military family. Get us out of there.
Oh and don’t be messing with my pills, man.
I have all kinds of crazy ideas, though, and the ones that are the most ridiculous, I keep to myself.
Seriously, though, this is a learning experience.
Some responses to Palin & Giuliani’s bashing community organizers that I felt compelled to share.
From the man himself.
And I really like her video.
My only critique would be that her graphic listing community organizers goes by too quickly. You can hardly see that Jesus Christ leads the list.
I also really dig this post from Ding on Bitch Ph.D.
“A small-town mayor is sort of like a ‘community organizer,’ except that you have actual responsibilities”
And a community organizer I respect very much once said:
“[T]here never will be complete equality until women themselves help to make laws and elect lawmakers.”
-Susan B. Anthony
It’s a classic case of biting the hand that feeds you. Without the work of community organizers, a woman like Palin would never be able to vote, let alone run for the second highest office in the land, and some day they highest. And yet, Palin would have you believe that Susan B. Anthony, Elizabeth Cady Staton, Martin Luther King, Jr., and other community organizers do not have any responsibilities. I suppose in once sense they don’t, other than the responsibility that most of us have to make our lot and the lot of our fellows better. The question is: Does it make a person more qualified to govern when they have been elected to lead than if they have taken it upon themselves to lead? I think that many community organizers have done as much or as little for this country and its citizens than many elected officials. To be honest, I’m not well versed on Obama’s record as a community organizer, and I’m not suggesting that he has is on par with MLK, Jr. or the suffragists. I think that remains to be seen. My point is, if you want to attack his record, then attack his record. Don’t bash community organizers in general.
Now I feel like I’ve beaten this topic to death.
I would like to post something on McCain’s speech tonight, but honestly, I tried to watch it, and I fell asleep. Then I tried to watch the replay, and it just wasn’t . . . inspiring, in any sense of the word. It was just bland. I mean, it certainly didn’t change my mind, as if it stood a chance. It didn’t even boil my blood. It didn’t do anything for me at all.
I’m watching a little bit of the Republican National Convention. I know, I know, I know. You’re asking why I would want to torture myself like that. I just want to see what they have to say.
And what they have to say is pretty exasperating. I’ve yet to hear any one suggestion about why anyone should vote for McCain. All they have to say is what’s supposedly wrong with Obama. All they do is bash and bash and bash. The only reason to vote for McCain is to vote against Obama.
Why so defensive, Republicans?
Because you ought to be. Because I think that you know that McCain is a hard sell to the American public. And so is Palin.
Side note – I can’t believe that Giuliani just tried to bring up the Republicans’ role in ending slavery, while earlier in this speech, he said something that sounded exceptionally racist (thanks Jay Smooth) about “Islamic Terrorists.” What about the Catholic Terrorists? What about the just plain psychotic terrorists? What about the Neo-Nazi White Supremacist Terrorists? Not a problem? Don’t need to protect Americans from those? Just the Muslims, huh?
Anyway, where was I? Oh yeah, the hard sell. Here’s the thing, the Republicans have got to know that the American public is tired of their shit. Tired of their national debt, which is the lead cause of our faltering economy. The reason our young people are being sent to die in a war that does not have a damn thing to do with the terrorists who have attacked Americans in our land.
McCain would rather lose the election than lose a war, and that’s just what he’s going to do. Because to “stay the course” is to ignore the will of the American people, who have spoken, and who have said, “Enough is enough!” He’s disrespectful of democracy, just like Bush, and for that reason he should not, and FSM willing, will not be elected.